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Author Topic: F/A-22 vs SU-47  (Read 62409 times)

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March 02, 2005, 08:06:27 AM
Reply #30
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Also whoever stated that the s-37 isnt as fast as what i said it was it actually is, you are just rubbishing it because you cant seem to face the point that WITH afterburners it is faster.  


ok, lemme get one thing straight here.  the F/A-22's nozzles were designed for low observability, with maneuverability being secondary.  i will grant that the F/A-22 is no where near the maneuverability as the S-37.  however, the S-37 is no where near the F/A-22 in low observability.  as for china developing something to detect stealth aircraft, i've heard about that as well.  that system still requires the use of radar illumination to function. however, it is unconventional in how the recievers work.  they use cell phone towers to recieve the signals instead.  i'm questioning the legitemacy of that system and everything else about it myself.  another item can defeat "stealth" aircraft: IRST.  IRST can track stealth aircraft using IR signature instead of radar reflection, but the technology cannot effectively track beyond 20-25 nautical miles.  HOWEVER! WHEN CONSIDERING THE CURRENT S-37 OR ANY PRODUCTION MODEL IF SEEN: THE F/A-22 can decisively and effectively dominate the S-37, as it is not as stealthy.  the S-37, if it ever sees service will probably recieve a sort of phased radar system.  that means it must still illuminate the raptor conventially.  the raptor makes it very difficult to do this, obviously.  hence, my opinion still remains unswayed.

as for your comment that the S-37 can outrun the F/A-22 on full afterburn, check the following site.  it's international and is not biased american or russian.  so no, it's not rubbish.

http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/s37/
look at bottom most picture's captions.
Quote
The Su-47 has a maximum speed of 1.6 Mach and a greater than 9 g g-force capability.

remember to convert from SI units to british standard units.  1500km/h is not the same as 1500mi/h.  the F/A-22 has a maximum speed of mach 2+.
http://www.fa22raptor.com/technology/data.html
look to your left, second chart down.

i do not dismiss the S-37 as a negligable threat, as it is an excellent aircraft, but i do not see it defeating the raptor in any scheme short of a dogfight.

"The only time a fighter has too much gas is when it's on fire."
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March 02, 2005, 03:32:01 PM
Reply #31
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Just skipped the rest of that stats, speed seems to be what everyone's bitching about...

S-37 Berkut Specifications:
Performance:
Speed: 1,555 mph (2,500 km/h)
Ceiling: 61,680 ft (18,800 m)
Range: 2,100 nm (3,880 km) -- typical

F-22 Raptor Specifications:
Performance:
Speed: 1,482 km/h; 921 mph
Ceiling: 50,000 ft (15240 m)
Range: No Statistic

Well dunno what's going on but my stats seem to somewhat contradict your stuff...plus I got mine all from the same site not all dodgy cross-referncing.
« Last Edit: March 02, 2005, 03:33:22 PM by Apophysis »


March 02, 2005, 05:47:14 PM
Reply #32
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YAY!!!! finally someone is seeing past the raptors two main features and realises the s-37 is better in many areas.


March 02, 2005, 10:49:58 PM
Reply #33
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Aren't there supposed to be advantages of FSW ???


Yes. Better acceleration, shorter t/o's, higher agility, and highter alphas.


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March 02, 2005, 10:54:19 PM
Reply #34
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Just skipped the rest of that stats, speed seems to be what everyone's bitching about...

S-37 Berkut Specifications:
Performance:
Speed: 1,555 mph (2,500 km/h)
Ceiling: 61,680 ft (18,800 m)
Range: 2,100 nm (3,880 km) -- typical

F-22 Raptor Specifications:
Performance:
Speed: 1,482 km/h; 921 mph
Ceiling: 50,000 ft (15240 m)
Range: No Statistic

Well dunno what's going on but my stats seem to somewhat contradict your stuff...plus I got mine all from the same site not all dodgy cross-referncing.


I don't know where you got that from, but it's wrong. The f-22 can supercruise faster than 1000mph and its ceiling is about 66,000 ft.


If a man hasn't discovered something that he will die for, he isn't fit to live.
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Am I the meanest?.....Shonuff! Am I the prettiest?.....Shonuff! Am I the baddest mofo low-down around this town?.....Shonuff! Yeah.....
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March 03, 2005, 05:58:04 AM
Reply #35
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s-37 is a Dogfighter, the f22 in my opinion is just a big craft with lots of technology that relies heavily on, not being detected and being able to have a high speed over time.
It seems the Russian idea of an domince fighter is a long range plane that will dogfight anything it finds and will probably win as long as the numbers its up against arent great.
« Last Edit: March 03, 2005, 05:59:26 AM by NZ_enthusiast »


March 03, 2005, 07:52:21 AM
Reply #36
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this argument is rather funny ;D
We have the enemy surrounded. We are dug in and have overwhelming numbers. But enemy airpower is mauling us badly. We will have to withdraw.

a Japanese infantry commander, situation report to headquarters, Burma, WW II


March 03, 2005, 09:35:06 AM
Reply #37
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s-37 is a Dogfighter, the f22 in my opinion is just a big craft with lots of technology that relies heavily on, not being detected and being able to have a high speed over time.
It seems the Russian idea of an domince fighter is a long range plane that will dogfight anything it finds and will probably win as long as the numbers its up against arent great.


Everyone always underestimates the F-22. It IS a dogfighter. It's a lot better than you think it is.


If a man hasn't discovered something that he will die for, he isn't fit to live.
-Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

Am I the meanest?.....Shonuff! Am I the prettiest?.....Shonuff! Am I the baddest mofo low-down around this town?.....Shonuff! Yeah.....
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Ninjas are cool.
-Me!


March 03, 2005, 10:05:41 AM
Reply #38
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go ahead, nz.  dismiss all the sites i have cited.  like i said, i'm not dismissing the S-37's capabilities, but immediately, i just don't see it as matching the raptor except in short range dogfighting capabilities.  in terms of kinematics and low-observability, i still consider the F/A-22 far superior.  yes, i'm factoring in afterburn speed as well.  i don't know what else to cite for you.  the site i got that information from is listed above, and is a totally legitemate site.  check it out if you don't believe me.  you posted facts as well, and i sure as hell have not dismissed them as irrelevant.  all i'm saying is that the current state S-37 is not a match for the F/A-22 in anyway for BVR, interception, or deep strike.  dogfighting, i agree that the S-37 is superior, due to the ingenious forward swept wings, canards, and 3D thrust vectoring.  however, as i said before, the F/A-22's nozzles are optimized for low-observability with maneuverability being secondary.  you can continue to ignore me.  i really don't care.  i'm just stating my opinion and backing it up with legitemate facts, as you have.  you don't hear me yelling about your opinion.  i just enter friendly debate instead.

"The only time a fighter has too much gas is when it's on fire."
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March 03, 2005, 12:32:48 PM
Reply #39
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I think the Su-47 only real weakness is its fuel load.


If a man hasn't discovered something that he will die for, he isn't fit to live.
-Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

Am I the meanest?.....Shonuff! Am I the prettiest?.....Shonuff! Am I the baddest mofo low-down around this town?.....Shonuff! Yeah.....
-The Shogun of Harlem

Ninjas are cool.
-Me!


March 03, 2005, 12:33:09 PM
Reply #40
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I think the Su-47 only real weakness is its fuel load....assuming it was a production aircraft.


If a man hasn't discovered something that he will die for, he isn't fit to live.
-Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

Am I the meanest?.....Shonuff! Am I the prettiest?.....Shonuff! Am I the baddest mofo low-down around this town?.....Shonuff! Yeah.....
-The Shogun of Harlem

Ninjas are cool.
-Me!


March 03, 2005, 01:19:53 PM
Reply #41
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i'll put in my 2 cents tommorow..
We have the enemy surrounded. We are dug in and have overwhelming numbers. But enemy airpower is mauling us badly. We will have to withdraw.

a Japanese infantry commander, situation report to headquarters, Burma, WW II


March 03, 2005, 03:04:17 PM
Reply #42
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Ok so basically if we can all stop ranting for a second...Based on what everyone has said, and facts that have been layed forward...:

F/A-22 and the SU-37 have their areas and their non-areas...

If you attempt to make a fighter perfect in everything you are bound to neglect at least something, trying to make something perfect usually enevitably leads to a hole somewhere which someone will pick at.


March 04, 2005, 01:48:56 AM
Reply #43

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Everyone always underestimates the F-22. It IS a dogfighter. It's a lot better than you think it is.


Yeah it is a dog fighter and it has good BVR capability.I don't know the bvr capability in the Su-47.


March 04, 2005, 07:50:40 AM
Reply #44
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the BVR of the S-37 is very respectable and it can most likely easily dominate the F-15, F-16, and F/A-18 series.  personally, i think the eurofighter can defeat it, especially with meteor missile.

"The only time a fighter has too much gas is when it's on fire."
-CDR Tom Sobieck, VF-51, 1989

USAFA 2010.  Cross into the blue.
2010: Strength Within.